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 gregors & terrys (DB's, Shirts and more)

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Should Alberto Contador win all three grandtours in one season?
Yes
50%
 50% [ 4 ]
No
38%
 38% [ 3 ]
Unsure
12%
 12% [ 1 ]
Don't know who he is
0%
 0% [ 0 ]
Total Votes : 8
 

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Fus87
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PostSubject: Re: gregors & terrys (DB's, Shirts and more)   Wed Nov 03, 2010 1:25 pm

On the poll: "Should Contador win all 3 GTs in one season" I voted yes. He definitely should. It would be a great achievement. However, I don't want him to, and I can't see him doing it, either.

On the DB: As promised, I had a look at it.
First, I very much appreciate your effort; I know first-hand what a huge work (and mess, sometimes) it is to make a CyM4 DB.

But I also have some things to criticize, or point out:
1) Riders' stats: generally it looks OK, though there are some I would have rated otherwise (e.g. Geraint Thomas: TT 80, but only COB 63?). Did you take the stats from another DB, or did you do them yourself?

2) Teams: Heizomat, Miche, NetApp and UnitedHealthCare aren't ProContinental teams (yet). They may not be the best choices. I know that you have 4 slots to fill, but I'd have taken the other ProConti teams (Carmiooro - NGC and CCC - Polsat - Polkowice). Scott - Marcondes Cesar should be left out as it folded halfway through the season. For the remaining two spots, I would choose the teams with the most success in 2010: Bretagne - Schuller should definitely be in. For the last one, have a look at CQranking.com - it's a great site. It's a tough decision, but I could actually lean towards leaving UnitedHealthCare in even though they're not among the top Continental teams due to their performance in California.

3) Several teams have only a limited part of their real-life roster ingame (Androni Giocattoli has 12 riders, CSF 12, Heizomat only 2 Exclamation , ISD 9, Miche 4, NetApp 4, UnitedHealthCare 2), others have riders that aren't on the team (Bettini on Ceramica Flaminia Question ).

4) No work seems to be done on the race calendar. Some races don't exist anymore (Tour de Georgia Crying or Very sad ), others have different dates (Tour of California etc.). Did you edit the startlists?

5) The budgets are way too high. SAX spends about 6,5 millions on wages the first year, but they have a 12 million budget. KAT spends 6,8 millions, but have a 15 million budget!
There is money in cycling, but not that much.
Also, you haven't done any work on the contracts, bringing about two problems: The minor one is that some riders have what I call a "0/1970" contract, examples are Geraint Thomas, Vladimir Gusev or Jacob Fuglsang. Have a look ingame, and you'll understand what I mean. On the other side, many free agents are listed as having a contract. You would want to keep these mix-ups at a minimum., but it requires some juggling work (I can explain the procedure to you by PM if you want).
The major problem, however, is that the contracts still have the same dates as in the BDB08, meaning that most of them end in 2008 or 2009. As the game starts in 2010, almost everyone is a free agent on the 2nd of January. It sure makes an interesting game with all-new squads, but it's not realistic.

6) You have 19 "TopClub" teams, the 18 ProTour teams plus Cervélo. There's no way you could know (I would found out by coincidence), but that will make the game crash. You can only have 20 teams participating in a race, and all TopClub teams are automatically invited to GTs and the former World Cup races. Additionally, the game invites 6 teams based on their previous results. In the original, 2004 DB, there were 10 TopClubs, leaving 4 wild card slots after inviting the 6. Now, 19+6=25 - as soon as you reach the first World Cup race and try to play it in 3D, the game will crash. There are two possible solutions: Either put a 20th team in the TopClub (I suggest BMC), or have only 10 TopClubs (obviously the biggest ProTour teams: e.g. Astana, Garmin, Liquigas, Omega Pharma-Lotto, Quick Step, Rabobank, Sky, HTC, Katusha and Saxo Bank) and 20 teams in the next tier, GS1.

Again, nobody's perfect. I did a lot of bigger mistakes and errors in my first DB, and I learned all the stuff along the way. It is a great first shot, and you're learning from the best Wink , so with some tweaking I can see you becoming an excellent DB maker. I'm willing to help you along the way.
However, maybe you should consider switching to a more recent edition of the game. I don't know how many people downloaded the DB so far; but to give you an indication, my first beta version of the BDB08-Complete has amassed 367 downloads over 2 years, with the second through fourth version scoring between 17 and 102 downloads. In hindsight, that's not much considering the work I put into it. I'm happy for the ~400 people that enjoy(ed) the DB, but it really was a huge amount of work.

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PostSubject: Re: gregors & terrys (DB's, Shirts and more)   Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:03 pm

Did you try the fake one Fus? If you did, did you like it? I made it for people to have fun, Joe Collins is my favorite fake cyclist I made up.
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PostSubject: Re: gregors & terrys (DB's, Shirts and more)   Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:09 pm

Ok, I'll note that I made a mistake making Pettachi from France....oops! and I made a mistake with stats like Sammy Sanchez or G.thomas.

On the other hand I did not edit the stages,but I did do the start lists, and I don't know what website I can find the team bugets. I'm using the Hannes Editor, Please tell me If thats not good for editing.
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PostSubject: Re: gregors & terrys (DB's, Shirts and more)   Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:14 pm

Oh! also I'm doing a carrer ands funny with all the riders going to so many different teams (which is not realistic).
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PostSubject: Re: gregors & terrys (DB's, Shirts and more)   Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:21 pm

CQranking.com is a great site with all the Photos.


Last edited by gregor on Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:23 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Found out that they don't have all the photos.:cry:)
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PostSubject: Re: gregors & terrys (DB's, Shirts and more)   Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:13 pm

I can't get any newer version bcuase i have no money. pale Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad Sad
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PostSubject: Re: gregors & terrys (DB's, Shirts and more)   Wed Nov 03, 2010 10:38 pm

You know, there is such a thing as an edit button. Wink

Didn't try the fantasy DB yet - only had a quick look at the real one.
That's also the reason why I didn't know about the startlists.
I have no experience at all with the Hannes Editor, so I can't tell you if it's good. But as Hannes has made some other very good editing tools, I presume it's good.
There simply are some things (e.g. the contract lengths) that you can't do with an editor, but have to do manually.
Sadly there is no place (to my knowledge) where you can just look up team budgets - normally they're not even publicly known. Sometimes a team announces how much their sponsors pay, but not very often; mostly the numbers are estimates by cycling journalists or "insiders".

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PostSubject: Re: gregors & terrys (DB's, Shirts and more)   Thu Nov 04, 2010 2:23 pm

Fus87 wrote:
You know, there is such a thing as an edit button. Wink

Didn't try the fantasy DB yet - only had a quick look at the real one.
That's also the reason why I didn't know about the startlists.
I have no experience at all with the Hannes Editor, so I can't tell you if it's good. But as Hannes has made some other very good editing tools, I presume it's good.
There simply are some things (e.g. the contract lengths) that you can't do with an editor, but have to do manually.
Sadly there is no place (to my knowledge) where you can just look up team budgets - normally they're not even publicly known. Sometimes a team announces how much their sponsors pay, but not very often; mostly the numbers are estimates by cycling journalists or "insiders".


Edit Button???
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PostSubject: Re: gregors & terrys (DB's, Shirts and more)   Thu Nov 04, 2010 4:46 pm

What editor do you use?
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PostSubject: Re: gregors & terrys (DB's, Shirts and more)   Thu Nov 04, 2010 6:43 pm

At every post, there are some buttons in the upper right corner: Quote and Edit (plus some more for me as I'm a moderator).
If you have to add something that is not on some completely different topic, and nobody has responded to your last post, it's more convenient to just edit your last post.

For looking at DBs or editing riders' stats I use the RAM Editor (see download section). I couldn't get the Hannes Editor to work, so I started using that one. And it's become habit; plus I find it easier to use than Hannes. It's in German, but as you're part-German, that shouldn't pose a problem. Wink


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PostSubject: Re: gregors & terrys (DB's, Shirts and more)   Thu Nov 04, 2010 8:16 pm

haha! I don't speak german, but I understand some because the Hannes editor is german.
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PostSubject: Re: gregors & terrys (DB's, Shirts and more)   Thu Nov 04, 2010 8:23 pm

I thought you were talking about an edit button on the cym 4 editors. Laughing
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